Massive argument on Fakebook about Vultology

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  • Forum Bot
    Participant
    • Type: Unknown
    • Development:
    • Attitude: Unknown

    @animal I can see that. He has this weird charm about him but it’s eerie.

    GreenCoyote
    Participant
    • Type: SeTi
    • Development: lll-
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    If you read socionics articles in general there is a lot of speculation.

    Plus VI in socionics isn’t as well thought out as CT is. CT visuals make a lot more sense, although im sure there is some crossover.

    I have never heard of this forum, but one of the names stuck out and i could barely listen to him when he talked. It was BOOORRRING.

     

    That aside, i’m kinda diggin the revolutionary vibe lol

    i know i can pretty much make any type fit me. My self identity isn’t set in stone as far as believing i am a type. But i do believe in animal’s story, some people actually DO know what type they are and if auburn types correctly then thats kinda the end of the discussion right there.

    There is some really brilliant stuff in socionics and i think they are onto something with intertype relations, but like animal said you don’t want to take the reality and then abstract off of it to the point of skewing the truth.

    However not many people know the truth or accuracy of another persons type, we know what we believe people are, people think they are what they believe they are.

    Auburn types me as SeTi which i have no doubts about, but i’ve had a couple insightful people swear i am NeTi but if you look at my family life and my relationships it’s all alpha people around me. And even if there are some gammas or betas, the alpha values dominate in my social circles. And there are some good things about alpha values that i see easily and am not afraid to promote especially if they have benefited me and helped in my development. I also probably have a lot more to develop on and will probably get in touch with my functions on a clearer level soon enough.

    Wow, this vibe is so crazy h ha. I can feel the revolution off the page! Down with the man!!! Lol

    court jester what did you start!? 😝

    Forum Bot
    Participant
    • Type: Unknown
    • Development:
    • Attitude: Unknown

    @greencoyote I like to get a feel for people before I launch a full on campaign. There is a method to my madness.

    GreenCoyote
    Participant
    • Type: SeTi
    • Development: lll-
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    Interesting you say that because there is a madness to my method

    Paul
    Participant
    • Type: TeNi
    • Development: l-l-
    • Attitude: Unseelie

    You can’t really ‘debate’ these things in a lot of communities. I gave up a long time ago. It’s all about vapid pontificating and shouting the loudest.

    When all said and done, most of this is completely hypothetical. Take a step back and see it for what it is – feeble minds attempting to grasp something way beyond our current understanding. Personally, I believe Aubs is on to something, but ultimately… show me the data or shut the fuck up with your nonsense. It seems to me that people in these communities just have to sound confident in whatever bullshit they spew, and people will follow.

    Fuck that. Think for your own damn self.

    Paul
    Participant
    • Type: TeNi
    • Development: l-l-
    • Attitude: Unseelie

    Speaking from experience btw. I’ve been ‘had’ before (see he who claims Superpowers).

    Forum Bot
    Participant
    • Type: Unknown
    • Development:
    • Attitude: Unknown

    @paul While I understand your reasoning. I am not as reasoned with as I guess I should be. I will at some point go back for more abuse and shouting I am sure in hopes that I change hearts.

    Paul
    Participant
    • Type: TeNi
    • Development: l-l-
    • Attitude: Unseelie

    Been there; tried that. There was a huge disparity between time/energy invested and meaningful return. It’s a fool’s errand, no matter how well-intended.

     

    You want to make a difference? Find another way. All of this is pie in the sky until some kind of super-AI can 100% it all for us. Until then, we have Aubs 😉

    Ivory
    Participant
    • Type: TiSe
    • Development: ll--
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    @Paul
    I agree with you! The return of those ‘discussions’ is usually quite negative (emotionally taxing) and you won’t convince people if you’re only arguing theoreticals anyway. They have their system and they are invested in it. Good for them. But so far, CT has the more concrete means of typing and the results are speaking for themselves. And that – the results – is where people can change their minds.

    Arguing on FB groups… Been there done that, as well. But productive it is not.

    • This reply was modified 9 months, 2 weeks ago by Ivory.
    Tea
    Participant
    • Type: NeFi
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Seelie

    “He had a test that he gave to a school and 75% of people came out as Beta NF. ”


    @animal
    , seems like a lot of disgruntled people who get typed Fe+Si and Te+Si here would fall at this guy’s feet. (insert Discord’s Happy/Wasn’t Me Ne Emoji)

    Animal
    Participant
    • Type: SeFi
    • Development: lll-
    • Attitude: Unseelie

    @GreenCoyote

    I also find Socionics brilliant. No theory is beyond scrutiny, and I believe the best theorists are the ones who understand that their work is one step toward the revelation of truth.  If typology is a language which reveals or discusses ‘real’ phenomenon, then the language is always developing.  The language of archetypes is age old, and the way to understand them is always evolving.  Auburn has written posts indicating that he sees his theory as one step in the evolution of typology – and that’s why his work is so REAL.  He doesn’t claim that he already has all the answers and there’s nothing left to be discovered. He waits for developments to reveal themselves.

    Socionics adds a lot of layers that don’t need to be there (like some of the Reinin dichotomies) but the basic foundation is amazing. And it WORKS.  As you know already, I (and my close crew) typed people using a synthesis of previous systems, which weighed heavily on Socionics, and most of the types we came up with were identical to what Auburn found. The ones we were uncertain about, which included my own, were basically “YES that’s what I thought but something threw me off… THANK YOU for seeing it!”  Like we knew, given the information we already studied, that this was right and we just hadn’t seen it yet.  There were only 2 cases so far where I was a bit surprised by Auburn’s typing of someone, and in one case Ivory had seen that type and kept bringing it up to me prior, and in the other, I’m still trying to figure out where I went wrong (if I did). There’s a third case where I could see TeNi for someone that he types as TeSi. But the most likely case is that I’m wrong and he’s right. 😛  But I take it upon myself to really examine this and see what’s not lining up.

    But yes, there is no reason to throw out socionics. It’s more about the typing method I think. Socionics is just another method to interpret a correct typing and gain more from it.  As is MBTI if you look at real theorists like Beebe, and also, Jung’s original work. There is a lot of ‘crap’ in all systems to sift through, but going through all of it and cutting the wheat from the chaff, it creates a bigger understanding. Auburn however, is the only one that came up with a method to type people correctly or very very close.

     


    @teatime

    The reason people aren’t happy with Delta types is because Socionics trashes them, and glorifies Betas. Overall Socionics is biased toward Beta because they lionize Se ‘badassery’ and they worship Ti ‘logic.’  The lack of those makes someone meek etc, in their system. The NiFe descriptions also are not too flattering unless you like being weak and helpless 😀 but in MBTI, NiFe is the most revered type. So people are willing to be seen as weak and helpless if it means they can cling to their glamorous MBTI typing of INFJ – and can fantasize that their dual is the badass lion god, SeTi.

    • This reply was modified 9 months, 2 weeks ago by Animal.
    • This reply was modified 9 months, 2 weeks ago by Animal.
    • This reply was modified 9 months, 2 weeks ago by Animal.
    • This reply was modified 9 months, 2 weeks ago by Animal.
    • This reply was modified 9 months, 2 weeks ago by Animal.
    • This reply was modified 9 months, 2 weeks ago by Animal.
    Forum Bot
    Participant
    • Type: Unknown
    • Development:
    • Attitude: Unknown

    They do.

    Forum Bot
    Participant
    • Type: Unknown
    • Development:
    • Attitude: Unknown

    @animal exactly why I DIDN’T want to accept a typing of INFJ. Also, Jack kind of talks down to me like I’m a weak piece of shit because of his and socionics view of IEI. Too be honest, I see him for what he is layers beneath, which is a scared little man, so I guess the feeling is mutual.

    They do glorify Beta’s and it isn’t right that they do that. All quadra’s have their place in the balance of things. To think one type is better or smarter than another is really limiting. I feel the key to life is to realize where you are weak and to surround yourself, or reinforce yourself, with people who’s strengths compensate for your weaknesses.

    Tea
    Participant
    • Type: NeFi
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Seelie

    I’ve never encountered someone who disagrees with CT once I present a quick case, because I use what people already intuitively know, and to be fair, because of the people I talk to about it.

    I’ve always dealt with people who don’t have a background in typology and are prone to dismissing typology. So there’s no Ego risk.

    Anyone who loves their own image more than Truth it not worthy of Truth.

    • This reply was modified 9 months, 2 weeks ago by Tea.
    Animal
    Participant
    • Type: SeFi
    • Development: lll-
    • Attitude: Unseelie

    Yep, it’s a much easier “sell” to people who aren’t invested in a type. There are people deeply invested in typology who still are open to being typed differently than their current typing, and over time I’ve learned to focus on those people. Actually that’s why our facebook group Enneatude was so small. If people were there to wank about their trophy typing instead of showing real interest in typology for the ‘truth’ of it, we kicked them.  Lol, this is our first rule and we stuck by it:

    1. Be open to type suggestions and impressions of your type.

    Time is the most valuable resource we have and you spend so much of it on enneagram boards. You can’t get your time back. So ask yourself why you’re here and what’s really important to you. Is it important to parade your self-typing and have your ego stroked by your friends cheering about it, or to learn something about your soul?

     

    Don’t get me wrong, we were very open to argument, protest etc. We didn’t assume we were correct either. But it’s the idea that someone is willing to discuss suggestions without taking it as an insult.  And sadly this meant we had to be exclusive because most people in the internet typology jungle are quite… RUDE… and not worth wasting time on. 🙁

    • This reply was modified 9 months, 1 week ago by Animal.
    • This reply was modified 9 months, 1 week ago by Animal.
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