Soft Readings: I

[Juan E. Sandoval]

Hello all!
I'm back-ish, still not 100% back but easing into work.
https://www.patreon.com/posts/jumping-back-in-26438297
This thread is for the soft reading requests from patreon, which I figured I'd post here also -- to make them more available for discussion and feedback. Here goes! (more posts to follow)

Andrew Hozier

Spoiler

Alpha > P-lead > Reviser Energy
Margin of Error
Most likely: NeTi l---
Less likely: TiNe ll--, SiFe l--l
Unlikely: Anything Else
Shade: Hozier is a classic Alpha ragged philosopher/poet/musician shade. Unkempt, shaggy, bohemian, much like the travelling musician NeTi's we've seen before (Andrew Bird, Tim Minchin, Bill Wurtz, Puffs, and possibly also Devon, etc). We can see the Ti/Fe oscillation in GIFs such as:
1:27

from video: youtube.com/watch?v=qtn-gAQX2z4
^ Fe Warm Swelling/Pushing, leading into a Ti Neutralization + Ji Eyes Disengage Down
2:43

from video: youtube.com/watch?v=XOtvAAdXD-M
^ Ti Pe Momentum Clamping + P Casusal Hands + Pe Loose Body Swaying + P Ongoing Movements
And here we can see Ti's mechanical glitching within the context of native Pe energy. Notice how his Ti stuttering of his hand is intermittent, and is ultimately embedded within a flailing gesture.
His composure is overall relaxed, loose, casual, curious/open, receptive.. with lots of reviser doubt.

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Paul Washer

Spoiler

Alpha > Conductor > Fe-lead
Margin of Error
Most likely: FeSi l---
Less likely: SiFe
Unlikely: Anything Else
Shade: Washer falls into the category of Fe preachers/life-coaches. Very classic example of a communally oriented individual, speaking to the church family and being a moral guide for others.
His videos are too long to GIF but here are a couple of screenshots:

^ Si Concerned Concentration
He has a wide assortment of Si signals, including confused stares, concerned concentrations and Si ramblings. Psychologically his approach is also very incremental, contextual and anchored/down-to-earth from what I can tell. Unlike FeNi's, he's not an esotericist in his style of spiritualism.

^ Fe Warm Swelling
And here we see one of the many conductor signals he has, with a very solid/firm delivery of hand gestures in sync with his head, torso, shoulders, head nod etc. Always on-beat and with emotional embedding.

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Hugh Bonneville

Spoiler

Conductor > Te-lead > Ne/Si user
Margin of Error
Most likely: TeSi
Less likely: TeNi
Unlikely: Anything Else
Shade: Snappy, clever, but concise. Hugh is very much in the same category as other TeSi actors such as Tom Hanks & Tim Allen, and possibly Steve Carell, Ryan Stiles/etc. In interviews his focus and explanation of events is very practical, this-is-what-happened and has a focus in the benefits and downsides of decisions. He explains that his backup plan was to go into law, which is also highly represented among Te-leads. He also has quite an eclectic film portfolio which we do see a lot in TeSi's lifestyles in general - due to the Te+Ne combination.
0:44

^ Te Snippy Head Shake + Te Jittering
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=DdkAd07M3cc
0:21

^ Ne Brushstrokes Eye Toggling + Si Slanting Edges
Now it's sometimes hard to see due to his Je-Conductor 'hardened-face' quality, but underneath that rigorous look there is a pair of soft, naive eyes that are scattered and toggle around. He doesn't seem TeNi to me, even though some still frames may appear to have Ni intense scowls, but this is due to conductor hardened face, imo.

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---

Richard Carrier

Spoiler

Je-lead > Te-lead
Most likely: TeSi
Less likely: TeNi, FeNi
Unlikely: non-Je-lead
Shade: Carrier fits neatly with other Te-lead intellectual heavyweights such as Richard Dawkins, Ayn Rand and Ben Shapiro. He's a historical buff (with encyclopedic tendencies), focusing on matters such as the history of Christianity, whether Jesus really did exist or not, and is a skeptic who suspects the Jesus story is a myth.
2:34

^ Te Snippy Head Shake + Fi Asymmetrical Mouth
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=9CQ8BVYLX5s
3:49

^ Te Snippy Head Shake + Te Plateau Emphasis (Gesticulations)
There is some possibility he's TeNi and not TeSi. In interviews (especially lower res ones) his eye quality is a bit confusing. He also has a lot of conductor "hardening" of the face and brow, but outside of this, his eyes themselves always look gently embedded as in high-resolution still shots such as:

Nevertheless, for a soft-reading it's best to consider him just Te-lead.

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Bart Ehrman

Spoiler

Je-lead > high Si > Fe
Shade: Like Carrier, Ehrman is another high-Si history buff, focused on matters of proper transcription of sacred texts over time. Now, Ehrman doesn't come down as heavy on the atheism as Carrier, but generally displays Si caution about trusting key sources. Si can manifest this way as well, with a sort of "check your facts" attitude. But Ehrman differs from Carrier in that he was motivated by the question of finding a dependable source of guidance, from what I can tell, and came up short in his quest. JeSi is more obvious with him, but we see his use of Fe in places such as:
5:11

^ Fe Warm Head Nod
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=GHJE7cetkB4
And if we look at interviews where he's off-stage (these are most telling), not giving a presentation, this is what we see:
3:14

^ Ti Neutralization + Ti Meticulous Fingers + Fe Warm Swelling
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=bh-j76VJnsY
Ehrman is clearly a Ti/Fe user, with the pace & tempo of Ti in his fingers, his face's neutralization, and the way he handles his Fe delicately. We don't see this delicacy in Te.

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N.T. Wright

Spoiler

Je-lead > Fe-lead > Si user
Margin of Error
Most likely: FeSi l--- Directive
Less likely: FeSi (of other developments)
Unlikely: Anything Else
Shade: N.T. Wright is unambiguously FeSi, down to the letter. Directive. Much like Herman, he too is an Si historical buff focused on "facts-checking", and making sense if history. These three samples (suggested by the same person) all have a lot of similarities. All are JeSi types and all are using their Je object-ivity to both seek truth and articulate it, with the support of a cautious, concrete Si function as their anchoring process. Their truth-seeking is steered by tangible information, and not by abstraction.
3:23

^ Fe Warm Swelling + J Rigid Posture (subordinate P) + Conductor
0:58

^ Fe On-Beat Emphasis + Fe Warm Swelling + Ti Delicate Pinching
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=wNlcPgNcHvA
The GIFs above show just some of the many clear Fe-lead signals he displays. And we can see his Si/Ne eyes in all frames, characterized by slanting outer edges, a confused stare, and concerned concentration.

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[Animal]

Purr 🙂 Welcome back Auburn 🙂 Hozier is Devonish indeed!

[Juan E. Sandoval]

Richard Carrier

Spoiler

Je-lead > Te-lead
Most likely: TeSi
Less likely: TeNi, FeNi
Unlikely: non-Je-lead
Shade: Carrier fits neatly with other Te-lead intellectual heavyweights such as Richard Dawkins, Ayn Rand and Ben Shapiro. He's a historical buff (with encyclopedic tendencies), focusing on matters such as the history of Christianity, whether Jesus really did exist or not, and is a skeptic who suspects the Jesus story is a myth.
2:34

^ Te Snippy Head Shake + Fi Asymmetrical Mouth
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=9CQ8BVYLX5s
3:49

^ Te Snippy Head Shake + Te Plateau Emphasis (Gesticulations)
There is some possibility he's TeNi and not TeSi. In interviews (especially lower res ones) his eye quality is a bit confusing. He also has a lot of conductor "hardening" of the face and brow, but outside of this, his eyes themselves always look gently embedded as in high-resolution still shots such as:

Nevertheless, for a soft-reading it's best to consider him just Te-lead.

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Bart Ehrman

Spoiler

Je-lead > high Si > Fe
Shade: Like Carrier, Ehrman is another high-Si history buff, focused on matters of proper transcription of sacred texts over time. Now, Ehrman doesn't come down as heavy on the atheism as Carrier, but generally displays Si caution about trusting key sources. Si can manifest this way as well, with a sort of "check your facts" attitude. But Ehrman differs from Carrier in that he was motivated by the question of finding a dependable source of guidance, from what I can tell, and came up short in his quest. JeSi is more obvious with him, but we see his use of Fe in places such as:
5:11

^ Fe Warm Head Nod
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=GHJE7cetkB4
And if we look at interviews where he's off-stage (these are most telling), not giving a presentation, this is what we see:
3:14

^ Ti Neutralization + Ti Meticulous Fingers + Fe Warm Swelling
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=bh-j76VJnsY
Ehrman is clearly a Ti/Fe user, with the pace & tempo of Ti in his fingers, his face's neutralization, and the way he handles his Fe delicately. We don't see this delicacy in Te.

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N.T. Wright

Spoiler

Je-lead > Fe-lead > Si user
Margin of Error
Most likely: FeSi l--- Directive
Less likely: FeSi (of other developments)
Unlikely: Anything Else
Shade: N.T. Wright is unambiguously FeSi, down to the letter. Directive. Much like Herman, he too is an Si historical buff focused on "facts-checking", and making sense if history. These three samples (suggested by the same person) all have a lot of similarities. All are JeSi types and all are using their Je object-ivity to both seek truth and articulate it, with the support of a cautious, concrete Si function as their anchoring process. Their truth-seeking is steered by tangible information, and not by abstraction.
3:23

^ Fe Warm Swelling + J Rigid Posture (subordinate P) + Conductor
0:58

^ Fe On-Beat Emphasis + Fe Warm Swelling + Ti Delicate Pinching
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=wNlcPgNcHvA
The GIFs above show just some of the many clear Fe-lead signals he displays. And we can see his Si/Ne eyes in all frames, characterized by slanting outer edges, a confused stare, and concerned concentration.

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[Tea]

Yay! I knew I had delta and alpha crushes!
I knew Hozier had to be NeTi, though I could see him also being polarized like Hrafn. Lots of Si in his lyrics.  "Ti stuttering of the hand" hahahah! Only *you* would say something like that, and that's why I love you!

[Juan E. Sandoval]

Trent Reznor

Spoiler

Beta > P-lead > Pe-lead > Polarized
Most likely: SeTi l--l +Flat Affect
Less likely: TiSe (p-heavy)
Unlikely: NiFe (polarized) or P-lead Alpha
Shade: Trent Reznor is trickier than average and has been brought up before so I felt the need to spend a bit more time on him than others. I believe he falls neatly into the category of other polarized Pe-lead musicians as per this old thread (most of which ended up being polarized SeTi's *not* NiFe's after the latest clarifications), and his flat affect also is further suppressing his animation -- making him appear very introverted. But here we can see his P-lead nativity:
1:31

^ Se Head-Eyes Parallel Motion + P-lead Eye-Centric + P Ongoing Movements
Notice how his eyes+head move in unision, how his movements lug/swing his head around in a kind of "bobble", and how he has a somewhat restless undertone to him. More on this below:
2:29

^ Ni Zone-Out + P Eye-Centric + Pe Body Swaying
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=mjEomq8IyA8
Here again we see how his eyes dominate his posture and the J gestures he exhibits come out of a place of bodily relaxation and casualness... as he drifts about left to right (both in his gaze, but in his torso as well).
2:19

^ Se Locked-On Eyes + Se Eye-Head Parallel Motion + Se Taut Eye Area + Pe Body Swaying
And here in a different interview we see the same thing happening. His eyes lead his composure, causing him to drift and for his torso to follow afterwards. And again we see a restless reed-in-the-wind rhythm, much more than a Pi-lead 'stumpy' rhythm.
4:25

^ P-lead Subordinate Judgment + P Casual Hands
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=1JXFCq5QaE0
Here we see his use of Je more clearly. We can see that there is a lack of structure to him, and his Je doesn't "hit" hard, but is instead a series of suggestive (questioning) gestures. Sometimes he's very Je in some interviews, but he lacks the finality and resolve of a Je-lead Beta.
And here is a video compilation of two of his vids, showing this Pe-lead (Beta) vultology:

Notice again how his hand gestures (Je) are side-to-side, dismissive/casual, unstructured and relaxed. And secondarily, his body is constantly sinking down and to the sides in a Pi way (conscious polar Ni + Ni grounded inertia).
Flat Affect:

^ Although he's not the most severe example of affect, we can see the 'fallen' quality of his face in images such as these. The flat affect signal is characterized by a downward weightedness of the face (especially the cheeks and the eyes) that is distinct from Ni (Ni can look bright and radiant sometimes).
This also contributes to the difficulty in identifying Trent's type, and why he appears to have a lot of introverted energetics. But his psychology (and body), from what I can tell, is that of a flow-oriented P-polarized individual.

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[Rua]

Interesting. I had been thinking of changing my typing of Trent to SeFi I--I but I couldn't get 100% behind that change either. Interesting that I ID'd the development level and the specific functions but reversed the hierarchy and misread the J-axis.
 
Edit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhMgLssi3VQ
After I watched this video a while back (and some other videos that included his musical partner Atticus Ross [who seems very willing to have Trent do all of the articulation in public]) I saw Trent fairly naturally taking on the articulator role, and I was very certain that he developed Je later in life, I just thought it was Te. In hindsight these are pretty obvious Fe gestures.

[Animal]

@rondo
I also typed him as SeFi I--I . That was the type I was expecting him to get, so I'm surprised only by the Beta typing. Which I need to mull over. 😀 But it does make sense, because my biggest problem with him being SeFi was that he is a pretty clear thinker.
[SPOILER]
Classically he is typed as NiTe - and he was typed that way on CT's old website. This was part of why I had moved toward Ni for my own typing, even though I'd usually typed as FiSe. People kept insisting I was Beta NF, and someone from CT told me I was TeNi based on my movements. I came here and saw a video of Trent which was scary similar to my most recent video of myself at that time. We were so synchronized in movement, in those specific videos, that it was uncanny.  And we also have a similar history in how we approached music and much more. I'll write a thread about this soon. Trent and myself have some fundamental things in common that I don't find often.
I have a lot to say about this since it ties into some of my own ideas about Se, and any time I brought up those ideas, people told me "Well it's because of your J functions."  And I know it isn't (although I have trouble articulating exactly what I mean, so I don't blame anyone for not getting my meaning; that's my fault. I need to hone in on exactly what I'm seeing and articulate it more precisely.) Trent is a good example of what I was talking about, and I happen to know a lot about his history.  Conveniently, he has no J function development, so it eradicates any possibility that what I'm pointing out is related to my developed Te, if it applies to him too. (Especially if he is Beta!) So writing and exploring his psychology may help me to articulate my Se ideas.
Of course I'm not saying all Se people are like me and/or Trent. But it will just help me to delve into his typing and psychology to hone in on my point and get it communicated more clearly, for what it's worth.
[/SPOILER]
Anyway, long story short -  once Auburn identified me as SeFi, I figured Trent was Se lead, but I figured out based on his movements that it was I--I . I was pretty sure of it. The only alt I could see was Ni lead with developed Se, but it really doesn't make sense then, why some of our videos match in movement, since I don't have Ni at all.  Not to mention, his psychology fits Se.

[Juan E. Sandoval]

@rondo - Yes, polarized Ni-lead isn't such a bad guess, and a while ago I may have thought Ni-lead for him too, before revisiting the matter of what a Pi-lead is.
tangent...
It's turned out that most actual Pe-leads are artisans of some sort -- musicians, painters, singers, athletes, etc -- and Pi-leads (proper) are more often academics, counselors and professionals (i.e. doctors, teachers, psychologists). I would say that Pe's have "a talent for the dynamic" while Pi's have "a talent for the scholastic." From the behavioral dimension, I've found this can be rather informative in conjunction with vultology. Trent certainly fits more into the former than the latter.
(more coming..)

[Animal]

I would say that Pe’s have “a talent for the dynamic” while Pi’s have “a talent for the scholastic.”

Love this!

[Juan E. Sandoval]

@animal - interesting. looking forward to your thoughts!
btw i haven't looked as keenly at his J functions (partly cuz of their absent development), but my initial impression is Beta. but i could admittedly look more carefully signal-by-signal at his J axis before ruling out SeFi...
i mostly focused on polarized Se-lead in this short writeup 🙂 ...since that seems most clear to me.

[Animal]

@auburn I really could see it either way 🙂 SeFi or SeTi I--I . I will also look at that more closely and mull it over. I'd be curious if you have a chance or happen to see the J functions more clearly defined at any point. 🙂 🙂
He is a genius of magnificent proportions... I absolutely love his work, his attitude toward it.... I connected to his work so deeply when I was most traumatized and couldn't connect to anything or anyone else. 🙁  Thank you so much for taking a closer look at him 😀

[Juan E. Sandoval]

Dr. Richard Horowitz

Spoiler

Je-lead > Ni/Se > Fe-lead
Margin of Error
Most likely: FeNi ll-- Directive
Less likely: FeNi (other developments)
Unlikely: TeNi
Shade: Dr. Horowitz is an awareness advocate with a human-centric focus, much the way FeNi's often are. Very much like FeSi Dr. Axe and FeSi Mike Mew (both of whom also advocate for awareness of little-known health conditions) Horowitz is both a doctor and a public speaker/lecturer on a heroic international mission to save lives. This pattern of Fe-lead doctor-turned-savior/celebrity is seen also in Dr. Peterson and  is a variant of the Fe-lead life-coach/mentor shade. Horowitz also seems to have a fair deal of Ni development, making him ll-- in development.
His eye anatomy is working against his ocular tension in some areas (i.e. naturally puppy-shaped eye sockets) but we can see the Ni eyes clearly in his still shots:

As for his lead (Je) function, we see it in places such as:
2:27

^ Fe Warm Head Nod + Ni Grounded Inertia + Conductor Energy
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=UdGeB0szaBA
1:12

^ Fe Zygomatic Smile + Fe Warm Head Nod (with a bit of a playful head-tilt)
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=UtBnLt7xTQQ
1:27

^ Fe Demonstrative/Shepherding Hands + Warm Swelling
from video: youtube.com/watch?v=UtBnLt7xTQQ

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George RR Martin

Spoiler

Margin of Error
Most likely: NiFe
Less likely: NiTe
Unlikely: Anything Else
Shade: George Martin may appear superficially to belong to the same camp as Tolkien, due to genre, but I think his approach is far more different than it seems. I'm not qualified to say too much about him, as I haven't read any of his books, but I've seen all GOT episodes and can already sense a type of Se realism that Tolkien and Rowling lack. And while his approach is rich in detail, it's not the kind of Si trivia-based detail that we see with Tolkien/Rowling, but is instead a more gritty, visceral, sensational/sexual detail that abounds through his series. This speaks to an Ni/Se author.
And much like the Pi-heavy Tolkien, Martin is also heavy in Pi (but is Pi-lead). His writing style is voluminous, panoramic and interwoven. It's a curious case study to how Ni might weave together narratives, but I need to think much more on this topic.
Vultologically, George Martin is one of the stumpiest Pi-leads I've ever seen. I tried to check multiple interviews and see if it's coming from old age and his body weight, but the viscosity goes beyond those factors and is there in all cases I saw. We see this Pi-lead (Ni-lead) density in GIFs such as:
0:22

^ Pi Inertial Energy + Ni Hypnotic Eyes + P Eye-Centric
from video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhiM_EMooek
Here is a video comparing him to other male NiFe

Keillor is, like Martin, a rambler and one that can keep stories going and going.
The one thing I'm a bit shocked by is Martin's highly graphic material, which would seem to suggest Fi morbidity and rawness. And I find this to be more typical in Gamma types. So NiTe is possible too, and it wouldn't surprise me. His gestures seem slow and swelling like Fe, rather than snappy, but I've not looked at every detail of his vultology yet -- although Ni-lead seems entirely certain.

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[Faex]

Hey, @auburn, what about the ones I requested 4 months ago on Liz Gilbert and a few others? I understand you shared them on patreon but unfortunately I locked myself out of my account and cant access the email I used. Would you post them too?

[Juan E. Sandoval]

I decided to split the GRRM/GOT/Fe-Te discussion to its own thread, since it's getting to be its own extensive topic.

@faerie - Sure thing! I'll add those shortly.

[Juan E. Sandoval]

Elizabeth Gilbert

Spoiler

Margin of Error
Most likely: TeSi llll Seelie
Less likely: TeSi (of other developments), FeSi
Unlikely: Anything Else
Shade: Elizabeth Gilbert is far too challenging a personality for me to analyze properly in a summary, but I'm gonna try. Fae and others, if you know her better than me (quite likely) you can tell me how this applies or doesn't - but this is how it looks to me.
Gilbert appears to me to belong to a shade of TeSi women that channel Ne+Fi and become find-your-own-happiness/essence advocates, after having faced the dissatisfaction of the one-sided Te-lead approach later in their life.
As the Wikipedia page tells me: "At 34 years old, Elizabeth Gilbert was educated, had a home, a husband, and a successful career as a writer. She was, however, unhappy in her marriage and initiated a divorce." -- This pattern of Te-lead-career-woman-suddenly-realizes-she's-successful-yet-unhappy seems to be relatively common.
Gilbert then goes on an Fi/Ne expedition to "find herself" and it appears to me that her memoirs "Eat, Pray Love" is in the same exact class of books as TeSi Martha Beck's "Finding your north star", TeSi Terri Orbuch's "Finding Love Again", TeSi Brene Brown's "The Power of Vulnerability" etc. A complete collage by TeSi seelie woman can be found below, taken from this thread.

The motifs of "take care of yourself" / "be self-empowered" / "listen to your heart" / "find your inner joy again" are very Fi in essence, but executed through the pragmatism of Te. Gilbert is a writer and yet in an interview she describes herself as not being a "creative" writer; not the kind that conjures up things on-the-fly. Instead she's more of an Si documentor of things, including her own life. In this interview we see her express her Si love of narrative & 18th century literature, her encyclopedic tendencies, as well as feminist advocacy -- which seems to be a common theme among Te-lead women.
She's an example of a Te-lead women with development in her lower functions, and one who has gone successfully through individuation. She's a "whole" self.
Vultologically... JeSi is fairly clear from the start, but she's not an easy case when it comes to her emotive expression. Due to seelieness and an integration of Fi, she has some emotiveness interlaced into her Te, so that it doesn't appear snappy. The nuance of this goes beyond the timespan I have to explain what I see, but just briefly:
1:41

^ Te Head Shake + Te Taut Square Cheeks + Fi  Asymmetrical Mouth (..at the end of the GIF.. up-right)
We can see that despite her politeness and softness, her mouth animation showcases an Fi/Te wobbling pattern and its default square tension, and her movements still have a plateau emphasis even though much of the snippiness is gone. She has a lot of Fi unbridled radiation which causes this more lubricated emotiveness, ..but this is different than Fe's coordination.
2:50

^ Je Gesticulation + Fi Snarling + Te Taut Square Cheeks

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[Juan E. Sandoval]

Glennon Doyle

Spoiler

Margin of Error
Most likely: TeSi Seelie + Flat Affect (moderate)
Less Likely: TeSi (of other developments), TeNi
Unlikely: Anything Else
Shade: Oh wow Fae, you're on a roll here! This reminds me of Jelle's NiFe streak. Glennon looks like another TeSi seelie woman, similar to Elizabeth Gilbert, Becks, and the rest. She portrays the same general story of living a Je l--- life in accord with expectations (career, marriage, putting on roles and checking off all the "do's"...until the real-self is lost in the "acts" we play) and then encountering a collapse... a mental "breach" and plunge into chaos.
However, unlike Gilbert, Doyle has less complete development --I think. Her Ne/Si seem to be less active, and I don't think she's llll, but I'm not sure of her development from this soft read. But what I do see is that she has a moderate flat affect (from a scale of 1-10... maybe a 5).

^ Flat Affect (moderate)
This also seems to be reflected in her story, from what I can gather. A destroyed marriage, a philosophy that life is "just a little bit more beautiful than brutal..." (showing an attitude that experiences existences as pain), and so forth. Her story is more tragic sounding than Becks/Brown/Gilbert.
p.s. Love Warrior ...sounds like a very Te-White-Knight+Fi-Rose motif of self-championing. It also seems to reflect a certain *struggle* that I need to think more about. This may help flesh out the idea of how Te/Fi users experience the phoenix reincarnation archetype -- and what it means to pair Te & Fi on one's way out of the 'hole' of depression.

^ Fi motifs of self-empowerment, embracing one's (messy) essence... + Te warrior/knight sentiments
Same class of books as those of all other TeSi Seelie women writers

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[Faex]

Thanks, @auburn! These were great! And I agree. Yes! Glennon's story is much grittier and tougher. She had bulimia from around 10, was an addict throughout her teens, only stopping at around 24 because she was pregnant which is what caused her to "adult up" and get married, be4 then had already had an abortion. After 24 she became a model wife which then fell appart later after she discovered that too was a kind of facade.
Liz Gilbert's seeliness had me really confused. I thot she might be Fi revisor due to her "true to myself" story, but always wondered about her single-minded work ethic which she always describes as being part of her from her youngest days. Her other book that sold well (not nearly the phenomenon that Eat, Pray, Love was) is Big Magic, it's about creativity and is very magical! There's NeFi whimsical woo all over the place but TeSi work ethic is emphasised right alongside it.
Liz, for example, believes that stories and ideas aren't made up by humans; she believes they have a life unto themselves: kind of like invisible little muses. They float around waiting for the right human to bring them into our 3d world and that's when inspiration strikes. But if you tarry too long, they leave you and find another artist. She tells a story about a book she wanted to write and put away too long then when she went back to it, found her inspiration/magic gone. Later, Ann Patchett described a book to her (that she was writing) which was exactly Liz's 'dead' story in very many details. So she has her readers make a pact with their inspiration/muse when it comes to them to keep at it and not abandon it. At the same time, Liz talks about how you can't burden your creativity with the demand for money and how she worked as a waitress for years and wrote in the evenings and weekends. So I agree about IIII.
Incidentally, these women all know each other and some are really tight friends, like Martha Beck and Liz Gilbert, but they're all kind of friends (Beck, Gilbert, Brene Brown, Doyle). ?
That was really great, thanks!!!

[Aletheia]

Dr. Horowitz is an awareness advocate with a human-centric focus, much the way FeNi’s often are. Very much like FeSi Dr. Axe and FeSi Mike Mew (both of whom also advocate for awareness of little-known health conditions) Horowitz is both a doctor and a public speaker/lecturer on a heroic international mission to save lives. This pattern of Fe-lead doctor-turned-savior/celebrity is seen also in Dr. Peterson and is a variant of the Fe-lead life-coach/mentor shade.

^ It's another one of my ppl! ^^ We be the Fe medicine men/women of the world.. Down with the FDA!!! We will prevail and heal humanity ?
Disease is one of the most prominent threats to human life, if not the most prominent. I've seen a lot of people, Fe and Fi alike, addressing this issue. Many of us are brought to awareness of the incapacity and injustice of the Western medical system when we suffer through an illness doctor's don't understand and can't help with. Peterson's daughter is actually one of these people (who also happens to be FeNi, I believe). Like so many with an autoimmune disease, she was essentially left to die a slow, painful death and had to find a way out for herself. She's an advocate for an animal-based diet to cure autoimmune and depression:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N39o_DI5laI
I think Ray Kurzweil and Dr. Nicholas Perricone also fit this Fe crusader for health shade. What's interesting about these two is that they emphasize the curing of disease as a means of enhancing overall human progress. They both have the focus of curing aging.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aI9JqAhPibc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qZLYKAJzKM

[Juan E. Sandoval]

Amy Wambach

Spoiler

Margin of Error
Most likely: FeSi Adaptive + Flat Affect
Less likely: Other Alpha types
Unlikely: TeSi
Shade: Amy is not part of a shade we've yet seen very comprehensively. Vultologically she's an adaptive Fe type with Flat Affect, and this shows itself in her history. Much like Glennon Doyle, her wife, she also has struggled with demons and has needed to persevere through pain and abuse. In particular, there appears to be a "martyr" quality to her -- a tendency to not show and not tell, which makes sense from an adaptive Fe under stress. We can see the flat affect in images such as:

^ Flat Affect (strong)
Now in her case, she has some pseduo-Te/Fi facial anatomy (a la caucaisan baseline reset) but her dynamic movements are fully in line with Fe+Ti. We see this below, for example:

^ Fe Zygomatic Smile + Ti Placid Smile + Ti Emotional Neutralization (+ Ti Meticulous Hands)
Here we see a style of emoting and neutralizing that is quite powerfully Fe/Ti when seen in conjunction. The emotive energy is "additive" and then falls off very quickly when Ti engages.

^ Fe Stop-Start Articulation... leading into warm Fe Head Push/Hands
Here we see the stop-start pattern of Fe/Ti and below we see...

^ Fe Warm Swelling + Ti Neutralization
...a clear example of Fe's warm swelling and emotional embedding, followed by Ti flat-lining the energy. While some of the swelling pattern can be imitated by very coordinated Te-lead women, the way we see Fe interact with Ti in this manner is not something that can be imitated by Te/Fi.
But chiefly, we don't see Fi/Te in the wobbling of the mouth or any of those dynamic signals even though she does show some pain. In terms of Ekman signals we see Ek-3: Fear and Ek-2: Sadness.

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[Juan E. Sandoval]

Katheryn Winnick

Spoiler

Margin of Error
Most likely: FeNi l-l-
Less likely: SeTi
Unlikely: Anything Else
Shade: Katheryn belongs roughly to the same shade of "strong woman" FeNi actors as Sandra Bullock and Gal Gadot, who plays Wonder Woman. Katheryn plays a viking role on television but more personally she is a blackbelt and leads blackbelt classes. This has some crossover with the Bruce Lee / Fe Body-Builder male shade, which is also part of the mind-over-matter trend. Fe-leads, and especially Betas, tend to have this combination of Fe dominance-displays competitiveness and Se vitality. But I've not encountered many woman FeNi of this shade before, so this is refreshing to see.

^ Beta Badass
1:00

^ Pe Bubbling Momentum + Je Gesticulation (double extroversion)
2:05

^ Fe Warm Swelling ...leading into a Ti Neutralization.. then Fe warm head nod

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[Becks]

@alerith
"Fe crusader for health shade" - I like it! I also see it for plant-based diet advocates.
I think that a lot of them are Fe-lead, or at least have developed Fe.
 
Gojiman (Fe-lead with flat affect)
VEGAN RESPONSE: Did Jordan Peterson's Carnivore Diet Cure His Depression?

(I am taking the opportunity to link this video as you mentioned the Peterson's carnivore diet, and I think that Gojiman nailed down the Truth about diseases related to gut issues)
 
Dr McDougall (FeNi)

 
I thought of these 2 because I watch them (or used to watch them) regularly so I'm more confident about their type, but I also think a lot of others could be high Fe: Dr Neal Barnard, Dr Klaper, Dr Esselstyn, Dr Joel Fuhrman.
Another one I follow is Dr Greger, but I think he is NeTi with developed Fe.

[Juan E. Sandoval]

Natalie Dormer

Spoiler

Margin of Error
Most likely: SeFi l-l- Seelie,  SeFi lll- Seelie
Less likely: TeNi l-l- Seelie, FeNi l-l- Adaptive
Unlikely: Anything Else
Shade: Natalie has some signal mixing along the J axis, so this is not the most confident soft read. But in general I think she is an SeFi with conscious Je and a lot of learned softness and an Fe-esque demeanor. But at the vultological level we can see a strong case for Te/Fi. At first I was skeptical because she has a naturally cat-like face, like Taylor Swift, but even factoring that in, the Fi signals show up well:

^ Fi Wobbling Lips / Fi Asymmetry / Fi Pursed Lips / Fi Resting Tension
And here is an example of her smile which is wide but still retains the "H" pattern of Te/Fi:

^ Fi Snarling Smile (wide)
We can see this Fi dynamically (+ Pe energy) in GIFs such as:
1:49

^ Fi Asymmetrical Mouth + Pe Bubbling Momentum + Pe Body Swaying
0:54

^ Pe Momentum + Je Gesticulation
She also displays unordinary vibrating giggles (Fi) in conjunction with Fi snarling smiles.
She also fits the SeFi supermodels + fashion icon shade along others such as Adriana Lima & Kendall Jenner.

But I think she has Ji conscious too, which shows in her meticulous fingers on occasion.

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[Juan E. Sandoval]

Frank Herbert

Spoiler

Margin of Error
Most likely: SiFe ll--
Less likely: FeSi ll--
Unlikely: Anything Else
1:20

^ Pi Inertia... with small Fe Head Pushes, then an Fe smile, then a Ti neutralization

^ Si Eyes + Conductor Hardening of the Face
Shade: The author of Dune. Frank Herbert is actually a fascinating example! I have to learn more about him but essentially, he's another Pi-lead scholar. Technically, he's not a scholar by trade, but his mind is the same. He says in this interview below that he almost became a historian (Si narrativism) but decided instead to focus on man's tendency to be corrupted by power (Fe and the Human Condition).

This is of particular importance to me because it relates to George RR Martin (another PiFe) and his focus. Now this is just a hypothesis, but lets suppose that Pi -- as a wary/cautious function -- operates as a sort of "warning" function for how things may go wrong in society. This is seen in Ni's conspiracy tendencies and Si's paranoia... but in terms of novel writing, it may also manifest in fictional political commentaries about how society might go wrong -- if we don't handle ourselves properly. Or it may just be a commentary on life (in a P observational sense) without making much judgment about it but painting a picture of mankind and how it is. This seems to be the case with both Frank Herbert and George RR Martin (PiFe's).
More samples might help cement or revise this pattern. @rondo - you might know more about Dune than I, I wonder if you have any thoughts?

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[Bera]

Very interesting !! And thank you for taking the time to type these people. I was really curious about Frank Herbert after George Martin's typing and after talking to Rondo about him.
Katheryn Winnick is one of the most badass women I ever saw and she plays Lagertha very well too. She is a combination of a strong woman with extraordinary combat skills who can also look fantastic when she wears a fancy dress. 🙂 I thought she might be Beta but I didn't know her exact type. I think she was very well cast for that role.
I wonder if Geralt of Rivia is the same type but I will open a thread for him, since he is a game character and not a person.
I didn't realize Natalie Dormer is SeFi; I thought she is FeNi or TeNi. Since she has her characteristic smirk/snarling smile, I thought TeNi was more probable for her, but now I can actually see she is SeFi. I always, always pictured her in court dresses. :)) But I guess even if you see her in long, elegant, royal dresses, her energy is pretty much the same.
Regarding Frank Herbert - I think what he says about power attracting the corruptible is one of the major themes in Dune but, to be honest, I read only part of the books and this was very long ago.

@rondo proposed FeNi for him and I actually thought I saw some Ni themes in the books.
His eyes and brows look very much like those of Si leads though. This puzzles me a little. There is so much talk about prophecies, recurrence, the use of a mind altering substance...oh, wait.
There is an order of women in the books - the Bene Gesserit. It's an organization concerned with politics and with genetic selection in order to produce the Kwisatz Haderach, a type of Messiah/Chosen One.
Reverend Mothers of the Bene Gesserit Order could access the Other Memory, that consisted in all memories of all their female ancestors and of other Reverend Mothers that shared their memories with them...and of their female ancestors. This actually looks like an Si theme. It is connected both to Si Indexing and Modularity and Si Collections. The Order is also highly dogmatic and relies heavily on ceremonies.
Look :

Min contributes to the preservation of important traditions, religions and cultures –reminding us of our need for stability and for never losing sight of where we’ve come from and just how far we’ve traveled. But more than that, Min brings the wisdom of the past into the present and revitalizes society with centuries of knowledge.

And (this is from Wikipedia but I will also look for quotes from the books) :

Reverend Mothers may also pass their own ego/memory combination to other Reverend Mothers at will, merely by touching foreheads. When a Reverend Mother dies in the presence of another Reverend Mother, the second will accept the ego/memory of the first to prevent the loss of the dying Reverend Mother's experience and ancestral memories. Especially when the Mother Superior perishes, it is important to take her ego/memory so that her plans and strategies may continue uninterrupted. 
Under extreme conditions, a large community of Bene Gesserit will practice Extremis Progressiva, a mass sharing of ego/memories with each other to spread all the ego/memories amongst everyone; thus, if one survives, they all survive (!).

This is amazing. I am also curious what you think, @rondo ! Also, @elsie - you watched Dune - the movie, maybe you have some ideas about Fe and Si themes that appear in it (though I don't know how faithful it is to the books)

@alerith - we also talked about Mikhaila Peterson on the chat a couple of months ago and thought she might be FeNi. She looks like a beta anyway, I think.

[Juan E. Sandoval]

David Pakman

Spoiler

Margin of Error
Most likely: FeSi l--- Directive
Less likely: FeSi (of other developments)
Unlikely: NeTi l-l-
Shade: David Pakman belongs squarely to the shade of Fe-lead political commentators, right alongside FeSi David Rubin, FeSi Kyle Kulinski, FeSi Alex Jones, FeNi Cenk Uygur. To a lesser extent this extends to a shade of Fe-lead youtube hosts and news reporters such as FeSi Ben Sullins, FeSi Jimmy BrightInsight, FeSi Sam Jones, etc.
As the pattern has shown itself, he's another JeSi public skeptic and critic. It appears that Si's caution and need to facts-check, channeled under a Je-lead personality leads to an individual who is highly rational and tends towards openly debunking/contesting false points of view --especially if they're placed in undeserved positions of power. There's also a bit of a secular bent, oddly enough, to FeSi intellectuals (a la Yuval Harai, Alain DeBotton, Kyle Kulinski from "Secular Talk") which is not too dissimilar to the way TeSi's tend to be empiricists (a la Richard Dawkins, Ayn Rand).
1:12

^ Fe On-Beat Emphasis + Warm Swelling + Je Projecting Hands ...ending with a Ti Neutralization
1:57

^ Ti/Fe Stop-Start + Ti Neutralization + Fe Warm Swelling
(from video: youtube.com/watch?v=mwbt8UAMgJk)
Vultologically he is very unambiguous, so I won't be spending much time on this one.

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