Why are so many Pi-leads old?

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  • #19472
    Animal
    Participant
    • Type: SeFi
    • Development: lll-
    • Attitude: Seelie

    I'm not sure if Auburn still types these people as NiTe, but he did in the old database. This is just some faces I can recall offhandedly:
     

     

     

     
    I don't think the 'vultology' itself is for old people. He also typed two of my mid-20s friends, @Thanatesque and @Q , as NiTe, and there are a few more in the Discord. @Tberg and @Gust are NiFe, and they are in the discord, and young.  There are other young Pi leads running around the community but I can't think of everyone offhand. Anyway, there's enough of them that I don't think the vultology itself is old. The fact is, my Pi lead friends, and the ones I know on discord, are unlikely to video tape themselves yapping about nothing on youtube when they are 17. They are more aware of how much they don't know and how insignificant their voice is until they build up a world view. Unlike me, a Pe lead, who was on stage at age 5 and a local celebrity at age 11. If I had lived in the youtube years there would be 5 year old videos of me singing and sharing my philosophy of life. We just think differently.

    #19475
    fayest42
    Participant
    • Type: FiNe
    • Development: ll--
    • Attitude: Unseelie

    I just did a little bit of a deeper look at the Pi-leads in the database to see if I could find anyone who might also have videos of themselves when they were young (say, 20s). Doing that has made me think that the idea that Pi-leads just aren't in the public eye in their youth is a pretty strong possibility. The Pi-leads in the database who are young are almost all non-famous people. And there are very few Pi-leads in the database with careers that tend to lead to being in the public eye at a young age (such as actor or musician). The most common careers appear to be politician and academic.
    Still, the very fact that the words we use to describe the energies of Pe-leads and Pi-leads (puer and senex) mean "child" and "old man," leads me to think that this is something worth exploring further. But I suspect it may be difficult to find Pi-leads who have videos at both a young and old age. I suppose it could still be helpful to see if the amount of Pe and Pi signals changes over the course of someone's life, even if they are not a Pi-lead.
    I made a list of some people for whom I thought we would be able to find video of them at both a young age and an old age. These are basically all actors, but if anyone can think of people in different careers, that would probably be better.
    Tom Hanks
    Hayley Mills
    Kurt Russell
    Ron Howard
    Mark Hamill
    Carrie Fisher
    Liza Minnelli
    Meryl Streep
    Robin Williams
    Bruce Willis
    Robert De Niro
    Arnold Schwarzenegger
    Shirley MacLaine
    Jane Fonda
    Elizabeth Taylor
    Sonny Bono
    Julie Andrews

    #19492
    Robert Mitchell
    Participant
    • Type: NeFi
    • Development: l-l-
    • Attitude: Seelie

    Here are some
    Tom Selleck SiFe
    Mr Terminator (easier than spelling his name) NiTe
    Niel Degrasse Tyson NiFe (with some Ne eye toggles for good measure)
    Peter Rowsthorn SiFe(Comedian of Cath and Kim, with Ne)
     

    #19536
    fayest42
    Participant
    • Type: FiNe
    • Development: ll--
    • Attitude: Unseelie

    @singularity, Niel Degrasse Tyson is in the database as FeNi. The others aren't in the database, so they might be good ones to compare young and old versions of if you think they're Pi-lead.
    I started out on my list by looking at Tom Hanks because I knew he was in the database, but I didn't know what he was typed as.
    Here are the videos I used:
    Young (age roughly 28): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZfTeLlXxeI&t=
    Old (age roughly 62 or 63): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYjw3B6K9qw&t=
    And here is what I saw (keep in mind that I'm still a novice at this vultology stuff, so who knows how accurate this is):

    https://cognitivetype.com/wp-content/uploads/hm_bbpui/19536/c5n28kw7hwe84fqyf3th5ymn5a7kuqaj.png
    After doing these readings, I looked Tom Hanks up in the database, and he's listed as TeSi I---. The video of him in the database is somewhere between the two videos I looked at in terms of age, but leaning towards the older side. You can see that I typed him as NeFi I-I- at both ages, but if you look at the signals I checked in the "old" video, you can see that a better case might be made for TeSi I---. I chose NeFi I-I- instead because I was giving more value to the 3 P signals I saw than the 2 J signals I saw, but given the abundance of Je signals and the relative lack of Pe signals, that might not have been the right choice. I was probably also influenced by the fact that I had already done the young typing, and I subconsciously thought the base type should stay the same.
    But more important in the context of this thread is to look at what changed about his vultology as he got older. You can see that his Pi/Si signals did not increase with age - in fact, they decreased a bit, but I imagine that's within the margin of error. However, his P, Pe, and Ne signals all did decrease - enough to the point that he seemed like a clear Pe-lead to me at a young age, and by the time he was in his 60s, it became much harder to make the case for him being a Pe-lead.
    Of course this one example doesn't really mean much of anything at all on its own, but I'm hoping this is just the beginning of this exploration and after looking at more people, we'll begin to get an idea of what the trends are. As a beginner, this process of typing someone takes me quite a while, so if anyone else wants to join in, that'd be great.
    (Side note: If anyone disagrees with any of the particular signals I checked, please let me know. I'm still learning!)
     

    #19550
    fayest42
    Participant
    • Type: FiNe
    • Development: ll--
    • Attitude: Unseelie

    Oh, I also wanted to share something I stumbled upon the other day. It's an article that says that people get more introverted as they age.

    You Get More Introverted With Age, According to Science


    I wonder if this could be related to a decreased use of Pe and/or an increased use of Pi?

    #19712
    artemisrain
    Participant
    • Type: NeFi
    • Development: l---
    • Attitude: Unseelie

    I think it makes a lot of sense if someone is seen an Pe lead when they are younger because more of their lives are dependent on social connection. Most older people have already built that up and can then spend more time in their Pi, which may have been their top function all along, but they had to learn to use a lower function to get along better. Also, older people are quieter in general, which seems to be associated with Pi in CT. I think older people are just wiser and know that keeping to themselves about several things is generally safer, though less exciting. 🙂 So they may read more as Pi in general, rather than Pe.

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