Soft Readings: VIII

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  • Auburn
    Keymaster
    • Type: TiNe
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    Hello guys!

    I’m gonna use this thread to drop soft-readings as I come across them, in no particular order. They could be from Patreon, Discord, or anywhere else. 🙂

    I’m gonna try to make this a regular activity, and pick back up on the readings, which are the core of this model.

    Here goes!

    Auburn
    Keymaster
    • Type: TiNe
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    Johnny Depp

    Spoiler:
    Most likely: TiSe

    Less likely: SeTi

    For a while I didn’t know what to make of his P axis, but after settling the question of the “Si” confused stare, and seeing how it is that so many Se/Ni users do that, we see that he’s very much Ni/Se. He has the variant of the upward scowl that we see in people like Ray Kurzweil, Morgan Freeman, and Justin Bieber — where the brow is lifted off the eyes but the eyes themselves remain cunning and with a lowered upper eyelid. Therefore, I primarily think he’s a Beta type, with Alpha as a possible alt.

    As for his energetics:

    Johhny Depp appears to me as a Ji-lead:


    ^ Ji meticulous hands, eyes toggling while head stays unchanged (face-centric), rigid body, disengagement

    ^ Ji meticulous hands

    ^ very delicate/meticulous hands, arms brought into the torso (receding), eyes disengaged

    Thus, I think he’s a Ji-lead actor, fitting squarely into the same shade as Jared Leto.

    Psychologically

    Johnny Depp is quite idiosyncratic, and likes to do things as a lone wolf- which is very Ji-lead artist motif. I think he’s a variant of a TiSe Ace, when it comes to acting as well, and goes overboard for the sake of “perfection” in embodiment, according to his vision. In the interview above at ~9:50 he says:

    Interviewer: I mean you seem to say take life on my
    terms if you don’t like it fine

    Depp: I do feel the kind of
    need to to follow whatever it is I’m after, I mean,
    I need to bash on into the direction that I’m going yeah it’s important to do what you want without much compromise

    Leto, when he describes his acting process, is known for recklessly abandoning convention and going 110%, losing or gaining however much weight or muscle is needed, and going so far as to live as that character off-camera, and he also likes to take on similarly bizarre roles to Johnny Depp. This is general Ji, but this is the sort of thing more likely to come from a Ji lead than Ji in another role. And, given his vultology above, we know that in his case it comes from his Ji-lead process.

    //

    Also, as a sidenote, there seems to be some room to explore something about high Ti actors here — and how the actual human actor may be able to transform or fade away very strongly, leaving behind mostly the measured persona. All acting styles are type-independent, but I can’t help but notice Fe/Ti actors may be prone to prioritize the performance to such a degree that they can totally transform into something else — rather than rework who they are into a role. Anyway, just some food for thought!

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 2 weeks ago by Auburn.
    Animal
    Participant
    • Type: SeFi
    • Development: lll-
    • Attitude: Seelie

    I’ve always taken for granted that Johnny Depp was Ji.  He is so meticulous and delicate. I just didn’t know which one. Of course, I am thrilled to see that it’s TiSe, considering he was one of my very few celebrity crushes, and I am very proud of my consistency in picking out TiSe’s as love interests throughout my life.

    Indeed he is very similar to Jared Leto, as you say. He’s also a musician.

    Auburn
    Keymaster
    • Type: TiNe
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    Adam Driver

    Spoiler:

    Most likely: NeTi lll-
    Less likely: FeSi l-ll

    Alpha:

    Adam’s brow hairs are raised at the outer edges, but aside from that his eyes are totally Ne/Si. Plus his body energy is too. We can see this difference in how he handles his body against Se/Ni Tatum in this interview:

    0:22

    ^ Notice Tatum’s grounded energy, dense movements, versus Driver’s more floaty and spunky body. He also does a parody in this timestamp, chanting an invisible audience saying “Driver! Driver!”

    Anyhow, the difficult thing about Driver is actually his energetics, because I think he’s conscious in Fe, Ti and Ne. But I think his order is NeTi lll-. Here are some GIFs of why:

    ^ Pe Bubbling Momentum / Body Swaying + P Eye-Centricity

    1:48

    ^ Pe Alert Perk Up + Pe Bubbling Momentum

    Overall he seems to lack the “structure” of a Je-lead, even though he’s got some Je usage. He doesn’t have as much goofball energy as some other NeTi’s but that tends to be the case in non-standard-devl NeTi’s. I think he’s J-heavy, with both J functions conscious, yet still contained within the flexibility of a P-lead. Here’s a GIF showing this in action:

    ^ P Subordinate Judgment + Pe Casual Hands ( + Gesticulations)

    4:44

    ^ P Subordinate Judgment + Pe Casual Hands ( + Gesticulations)

    Notice the sideways movement of the hands, and how they don’t “hit” powerfully. This tends to be how all his gesticulations are, if you look at him across videos, with very few exceptions. Also, in this Colbert video, his vultology is a direct match to NeTi lll- Matthew Gray Gubler in the database. They look quite the same when placed side by side in the codifier.

    Still, other Alpha types are not out of the question and FeSi is not impossible.

    (P.S. – He has an anatomically skewed/slanted mouth. This is clearly not Fi/Te though, but a physical feature.)

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
    Auburn
    Keymaster
    • Type: TiNe
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    Bob Marley

    Spoiler:

    Most likely: NeTi l–l Fallen Affect
    Less likely: SeTi l–l Fallen Affect
    Unlikely: Pi-lead?

    Alpha:

    Bob Marley is a polarized P-lead, like so many musicians from previous eras. He’s super chill and has a philosophy that’s very flow-based.

    ^ P Fluid Posture + Pe Casual Hands + Pe Restless Momentum

    He seems Pe-lead with development in Pi, although he’s another one of those developments that is complicated by drug use, since we don’t yet have a way to differentiate out the vultological effects layered atop of a person from drugs, from their type. Yet, it’s also possible that prolonged drug use may literally lead to changes in consciousness, such that it effectively changes development level (of Pi in this case). He does seem to have an elaborate (religious/spiritual) worldview, which is in line with conscious Pi. And he has elements of Si psychology, such as being more of a biblical literalist and having local attachments to land — which, just comes out more esoterically in Ni/Se users normally, especially when they’ve been introduced to mind altering substances too.

    He has a disgust expression on him constantly, but I actually don’t see anything else Fi/Te about him, and even his disgust expressions seems relaxed rather than pinched around the mouth. And he also displays GIFs like:

    3:54

    ^ Fe Ballistic Velocity + Ti Neutralization

    So I see him as a solid Fe/Ti type.

    He seems to fit a certain shade of Alpha “hippie” – with a kind of “make peace and love” advocacy. Tupac (Alpha) comes to mind too, I think?

    Also, he has moderate fallen affect.

    Sidenote: One thing though, that’s less clear to me is the P axes, because of how the eyes are affected. In general his eye shape and the way they sit in the sockets seems to align with Ne/Si, but he also has a lowered eyelid at times (from smoking?) and his body seems to be grounded. Again, I don’t know to what degree drug use affects vultology, so I have to keep his type open as either being that:

    • He’s an NeTi who has occasional lowered eyelids and groundedness from smoking
    • He’s an SeTi with eye anatomy that is more prototypically Ne/Si

    Since this is a soft-reading I’m going to go with NeTi l–l, but leave SeTi l–l open as well. Though I don’t see any other type being possible.

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
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    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
    Hrafn
    Participant
    • Type: SiTe
    • Development: l-ll
    • Attitude: Seelie

    He seems Pe-lead with development in Pi, although he’s another one of those developments that is complicated by drug use, since we don’t yet have a way to differentiate out the vultological effects layered atop of a person from drugs, from their type. Yet, it’s also possible that prolonged drug use may literally lead to changes in consciousness, such that it effectively changes development level (of Pi in this case).

    […]

    In general his eye shape and the way they sit in the sockets seems to align with Ne/Si, but he also has a lowered eyelid at times (from smoking?) and his body seems to be grounded. Again, I don’t know to what degree drug use affects vultology, […]

    Eric TWFP has some videos where he takes some bong-rips in the middle….maybe those could be helpful for observing the effect of grass on vultology (although one assumes he could have been high to begin with).

    But that raises the whole question, which you hint at, about how many of the rockstars, etc., in the database, are under the influence of one substance or another at the time of their interviews. Let alone longer-term prescription medications like anti-depressants, etc. In fact, I’m pretty sure too much coffee tends to give me more “extroverted” energetics. (Or are you mostly wondering about long-term effects?).

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Hrafn.
    Auburn
    Keymaster
    • Type: TiNe
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    @hrafn – oh right. Though my guess would be that he might have already been high from the start, yeah.

    Indeed it is a open question – and a potentially answerable one. As with any medical test you take, the test results depends on controlled conditions (i.e. don’t eat food in the morning before a blood test). Vultology at the moment has been designed with certain normal conditions in mind. But we could also change the framing and examine a variety of people under the influence, versus their sober forms, to see just what, and how much, influence it has on their vultology.

    Already I can tell that it tends to amplify fluidity (i.e. P), and relax rigidity (i.e. J). But see, what’s interesting to me is not to see this as an invalidation of vultology results, but actually a confirmation of it. Isn’t it so interesting that when a person takes substances to loosen their mind, their body also loosens at the same time. Even there you can see the tangible, very real and direct link between mind and body. So we could also say that those under the influence of drugs are literally less J at that time, at this is not a measurement error. It’s simply not caused by innate type necessarily, but by a chemical context.

    So therefore, if prolonged drug use makes it so a person’s newfound “sober” vultology has been altered to be more fluid, it follows from vultological principles that it’s because their cognition literally *is* more fluid now. And this does seem to match. What this might mean, neurologically, I dunno, but perhaps certain frontal, left-brain (just a guess) faculties have been silenced or released from hard work — so that the individual is simultaneously less cognitively rigid and physically rigid.

    And this is why I theorize that the results of prolonged drug use on vultology may not necessarily be an error, but be accurately portraying the person’s mind. It’s just that the result may not be strictly typological/genetic in origin, but more akin to P function development. Psychedelics in particular are very perceptual in nature, so I wouldn’t be surprised if they kickstart actual cognitive development of perception.

    ~

    I’ve gone off on a tangent here 😀 but feel free to reply, and I can make this its own thread if necessary!

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
    Auburn
    Keymaster
    • Type: TiNe
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    Oliver Perrin (Semiogogue)

    Spoiler:

    Most likely: TeNi Fallen Affect
    Less likely: FeNi Fallen Affect

    Likely Gamma

    Semigogue is definitely either TeNi or FeNi. I don’t have time to tally up this signals to be fully sure, but while he displays some ballistic movements, his facial expressions are of the sort that Fe-Ti users cannot really fake. So, logically, it’s more likely that a Te can learn to gesticulate better, rather than an Fe ‘learn’ to have asymmetrical expressions and so forth.

    Semigogue has an esoteric youtube channel at: https://www.youtube.com/c/Semiogogue

    Delrake put together this great video: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Qep5Pw9hZuIUZvq5H0qfl9GxwrKNpL-2/view

    I’m fascinated by his videos right now — and how much his Ni shows up in his thinking. I almost wish to make him a case study for what I described in this thread recently, about Ni (V-) computation. He literally goes through an analysis of the intersectional objects in images, similar to what I did in that thread, in this video starting at 3:33

    His logo: ….

    …is itself intersecting coordinate objects, or archetypal symbols. Remember how I said the absolute end of this process is the identification of simple geometries? That logo is a graphic representation of that simplicity and distillation. “Read the signs” is also quite a multifaceted statement because it IS graphic, as a P function is perception. So it literally is sign-based, but it’s symbolic signs that are conceptual isomorphisms.

    Semigogue talks in his videos through these symbols, seeing the conceptual redundancies in society. As he talks in his videos he explains it all in terms of these intersecting archetypal symbols reappearing in society (as forms of the father archetype, mother archetype, etc) much like Jordan Peterson. He gives me major Peterson vibes, really —  if Peterson wasn’t trying to be academic and just let loose into his latent shamanic impulses. But his immersion into esoterica is of a flavor more typically seen in Gammas, which get a lot more literally involved in occult practices – i.e. crystal witches and so forth. And in that way he’s more similar to NiTe Teal Swan.

    Unfortunately I cannot easily GIF his videos since they go past the threshold of giphy.com and makeagif.com is being fussy with me right now. But I might come back in and add more GIFs later.

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Auburn.
    Delrake
    Participant
    • Type: SeFi
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Unseelie

    Oh yeah, this guy is beyond fascinating. My mind is blown every time I watch his videos.

    In this lecture, he talks about writing, language, and symbolism as a sort of “Pi” in external form. Reminds me of Model 2 Perception a bit.

    Spoiler:
    Spoiler:

    As for his vultology, he does have a lot of Pe spunk similar to Robert Downey Jr, but then he also reaches into Ni for lengthy periods trying to explain a concept. What’s interesting is he never really loses that Je+Se momentum despite the long esoteric rambles. It’s kind of like he takes his foot off the gas to glide through a Pi recall (even for minutes at a time) but he doesn’t hit the brakes if that makes sense. Idk though, just thinking out loud here!

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Delrake.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Delrake. Reason: typo
    Auburn
    Keymaster
    • Type: TiNe
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    Eddie Redmayne

    Spoiler:

    Most likely: NeTi l-l-
    Less likely: NeTi of other dev, FeSi
    Unlikely: Anything Else

    Eddie has a clear Alpha face, with zygomatic smiles and gently embedded eyes, raised upper eyelids and lax preseptal area. However, he also displays dynamic Ne/Si signals such as gangly movements, and levity.

    0:58

    ^ Ne Levity + Ne Gangly Movements

    As for his energetics, it’s not always clear because he has Je development, but there are moments where Pe-lead really stands out.

    1:08

    ^ P Fluid Posture + Pe Body Swaying (Pe Casual Hands)

    0:46

    ^ Pe Restlessness + P eye-Centricity + Pe Casual Hands

    And when he does use Je, it comes from this fluid baseline, even if the movements are vertical and punctuated:

    2:00

    ^ P Subordinate Judgment

    Auburn
    Keymaster
    • Type: TiNe
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    Joe Rogan

    Spoiler:

    Most likely: SeTi IIII
    Less likely: SeTi of other development
    Unlikely: FeNi

    ^ Beta

    Joe Rogan is a fascinating person. I wanna get into that in a bit, but first a little about his vultology. He has droopy/rounded eyes, which might at a glance make him seem Ne/Si, but atop of that anatomical roundness, he has a lowered upper eyelid, as well as a subtly raised preseptal area. However, even putting these matters aside, his body energy is wholly grounded, dense and Se/Ni.

    As for his energetics… I think he might be IIII in development — possibly the only one I’ve seen. Alternatively, he could be SeTi I-II like Calin. His Ji is the one that seems a little less obvious, but the others are clear. He’s a rundown of some of these signals.

    Pe-lead

    I’m choosing an interview where he’s the one being interviewed, rather than his podcast style talks, because in those talks he’s restricted to the mic position, and because we want to see his own un-premeditated responses.

    Se-lead

    12:44

    ^ Se Eye-Head Parallel Movement, P Eye-Centricity + Se Grounded Energy

    Pe

    ^ more P Eye-Centricity, Pe Restless Momentum… and P Subordinate Judgment (gesticulations)

    Notice how the hits lack finality and force.

    Je Development

    However, at times they can have much more force and power, yet still lack the J structure:

    18:12

    ^ Fe Gesticulations + Fe Head Nods (yet… subordinate Judgment)

    19:14

    ^ Fe Warm Gesticulations + Fe Head Nods (yet.. subordinate Judgment)

    So we see here that he’s got a degree of Je development, which I believe crosses over into conscious territory. Je+Pe are both there. But then, in a paradoxical mixture of energies, his double-extroversion itself is toned down by a heavy dose of inertia, and Pi viscosity… as well as Ji pauses.

    Edit: I wanted to go into Pi too but I don’t have time to GIF every function — since it’s such an involved process to find them all. But sufficient to say that, if you compare Joe Rogan to a typical Pe l— development, you’ll see he’s a lot more potato-y, and heavy seated. His movements, while spunky, also don’t do very many big flails.

    Ji Development

    But I’ll jump now to some Ji moments:

    ^ Ji Eyes Disengage Down + Rigidity

    17:21

    ^ Ji Momentum Halting

    There are better GIFs than these out there, but these are a few I found where he displays his Ji. In general, when Rogan is interviewing guests — especially academics — his Ji really comes out in how he tries to delve into the technicalities of what they’re saying, and really slows down his tempo in order to build up the other person’s argument from first principles up.

    He has a great ability of doing this from a point of view that a laymen can follow.

    Psychology

    Psychologically, Joe Rogan is also very Pe, especially in his youth. He’s got a long career as a standup comedian — a field dominated by Pe-leads — and has described his career as directionless. He says he’s taken things as they come, rather than ever had a sort of meta-vision for his life. Someone says “hey u wanna do acting” and he says “eeh, okay!”, etc. This Pe fluidity is reflected in his entire person.

    Not to mention his form of comedy itself really has some Se persistence effects and vividity in it. It’s that type of ‘shock’ humor that works by amplification of experiences (Se). His role in Fear Factor seems to follow from this same doubling-down and amplification of sensory experiences. Or at least, I’m sure his type contributed to him being able to lead it out. Wowness.

    ~ ~ ~

    The last thing I’ll say about Joe Rogan (there’s so much, I can’t grasp it all) is that he also has a signature Se/Ni form of esotericism. In some of his interviews, his vortical views really do come out — and he has a form of spiritual or mystical undertone to him that others don’t often recognize, until it comes out. This is also reflected in his channel logo. I find his logo to be an emblem, or icon, of that self-same aspect of him —

    From a mythological perspective, what you see in this image is the third-eye (Ni), but right under that we see too very amped Se eyes and a comical Fe smile. There’s a kind of “ridiculousness” and childishness …juxtaposed to depth and esotericism — which aptly speaks to Rogan as a Puer Se with an Ni mystic bent.

    This is not the logo of a high Ni conductor, since high Ni’s do not satirize their function. Instead, high Se’s channeling Ni are the ones who tend to satirize it, yet integrate it into personhood to some recreational degree (Pe), rather than being diehard worldview adherence.

    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by Auburn.
    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by Auburn.
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