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NiFe Rabbi's with Fe conscious

Home 2023 › Forums › Vultology & Learning Center › NiFe Rabbi's with Fe conscious

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  • #19024
    bella
    Moderator
    • Type: TiNe
    • Development:
    • Attitude: Unknown

    NiFe II-- Rabbi Yuval Cherlow


    Ni gaze and rambles + Fe subordinate judgment. What I found interesting about Rabbi Cherlow is that his focus in mainly on Fe domains - he is part of the Israeli ethics committee and speaks mostly about social justice issues, while avoiding the role of a mystic.  Although he is knowledgeable in metaphysics he prioritizes the instrumental function they can play in the Fe domain above the focus on their philosophical and ontological value, and his approach to life seems to be quite pragmatic.
    NiFe II-- Rabbi Elisha Vishlitzky


    Similarly to the sample above, here too is an NiFe who prioritizes Fe over Ni in ego fixation.  Rabbi Elisha focused on character development (mainly as it pertains to treating others), social justice and the removal of both personal and collective/systematic (governments etc) corruption as a baseline for any spiritual goal.  The spiritual, holy and mystical are viewed as important - but never as surpassing the basis of the most fundamental -  good character and social justice.  There is danger in mistaking yourself for being privy to the former, if you lack the latter, for such is not possible.  Thus, there is a constant attempt to "cleanse" away any fuzziness that may surround spiritual concepts and demystify their glorious aura.  For example, he may state that feeling elevation in prayer does not make one holy,  rather one should "take a mop and clean the floor!" -- start there, by being helpful and humble and knowing you don't deserve a reward for it either.  That, if anything, is a path towards any true holiness.
    Ni+Fe Rabbi Abraham HaCohen Kook

    There is very little video footage of Rabbi Kook, but he seems to be NiFe (alt:FeNi), with Fe consious.  But unlike the previous two Rabbi's in the thread, Rabbi Kook was a also a classic (Kabbalistic) mystic - thematic, cryptic, poetic, metaphysical meta-view. He had the 'guru' quality of the Ni mysticism alongside the Fe passion and zealotry.
    ....
    But the first two samples kind of break my assumption that all Ni leads are necessarily mystical thinkers in the generic sense. Perhaps having Ni as a conscious function in itself 'demystifies' mysticism from its numinous quality?

    #19041
    fayest42
    Participant
    • Type: FiNe
    • Development: ll--
    • Attitude: Unseelie

    I think it's interesting to consider how Auburn's theory about unconscious functions being more "fantastical" and conscious functions being more "practical" applies to certain functions that have these qualities in and of themselves--namely Ni being mystical and the Je functions being practical. Does the mystical Ni become some kind of practical mysticism when it's conscious? And does the practical Fe or Te have some kind of fantastical practicality when it is unconscious? What do practical mysticism and fantastical practicality look like?

    #19044
    Juan E. Sandoval
    Keymaster
    • Type: TiNe
    • Development: l--l
    • Attitude: Adaptive

    Great finds!

    Perhaps having Ni as a conscious function in itself ‘demystifies’ mysticism from its numinous quality?

    I think what we're seeing with these two NiFe ll-- rabbi's is an ego and developmental focus on their Je (Fe). As we've seen with many other samples, non-standard development often means that the person's cognitive focus is on that non-first function. Yet, their cognition remains in the same hierarchy when it comes to its weight of metabolism.
    So in these two rabbi's we see all the qualities of Pi precedent-focus, worldview rambling, narrativism, exhaustive understanding of global/world-context, but there is a focus on application (Je) of that knowledge. Inversely, the NiFe l--- development has no other outlet, so Ni is the sole conscious process and its phenomenology is given full weight.

    @fayest42
    - mmh, y'know the curious thing about Ni is that, for Ni-leads it's not mystical. And what I mean by that is that an Ni-lead experiences their Ni not as esoteric but as normative as anything can be. Even if they appear quite mystical to the outsider, the Ni-lead him/herself feels he is just stating a straightforward view of the world. And arguably they are. So there's a paradox in perception between the individual and the public.
    But when Ni is in the polar position, for instance in SeFi's with unconscious Ni, what we see is behavioral trends such as dabbling in divination/tarot, crystals, astrology, the occult, etc. Most often the Se-leads are aware, to some degree, that their activity is mystical and they participate in it because they feel a muse calling from Ni. This is the SeFi "gypsy" shade described in the book.
    ~
    (Oh, as far as "conscious" = "practical" goes, you may be right that I could pick a more function-neutral word since there's overlap with Je! This is more of a semantic artifact, but lemmy see if I can explain...)
    So for example, Ni-leads do have more practical use of Ni in that they use it to detect and anticipate the sort of large-scale societal/worldly trends that one could only do so with years and years of accumulated datasets and historicized interweaving of those datasets. The practical application in this case is the ability for Ni to operate as a source of temperance, caution, world context, anticipation, knowledge, etc. The Ni muse, by contrast, will lack the large web to give those answers (making it less 'practical'), but it will have a much more potent numinosity.

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