Reply To: God, Patterns, and Reality

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Bera
Moderator
  • Type: SeFi
  • Development: ll--
  • Attitude: Seelie

I don’t know if God exists or not.  So, this post will be about what I think about the theories/beliefs mentioned here and about other theories that might be true. This is a pretty long post, so I will try to organize it a bit. 🙂

1. About a personal God

I think there are some points against this theory to be considered.They are not really arguments, because in this particular case there will always be the counter argument – but we are humans, we can’t understand God’s will.

But, anyway, there are some issues that make me doubt the existence of a personal God:

– there is a lot of suffering in the world;

– suffering is not equally or fairly distributed (unless you believe in reincarnation – that would make suffering fairly distributed, based on everyone’s deeds in their past lives… but most people who believe in a personal God don’t also believe in reincarnation, which is a pity, because it would support their belief in God’s fairness);

there is a huge part of the Universe completely empty, unoccupied by any beings. (I think this is what Auburn also says and it is a problem indeed but I will get back at it).

Of course a human could not understand God’s mind but these points suggest that if there is a God, he is not personal. If he was personal and cared about everyone’s lives, there would be no unjust suffering (for example a child dying or an animal being eaten by another animal).

As I said before, this only applies if you don’t believe in karma & reincarnation. Or in any other theory that would somehow solve this issue. But I really can’t see any logical alternative to this one. Heaven and hell or Judgement Day theories don’t solve the huge issue that animals and plants are suffering horribly without being guilty of anything. Karma does, but it has other weak points, I guess.

Also, if there was a personal God who created the Universe and got involved in our lives, I don’t understand why he would keep such a huge part of the Universe without any inhabitants. Of course, the abiotic could have some purpose but it’s so much of it… :)) It just doesn’t look like something a personal God who follows our lives and focuses on everyone’s deeds and moral development would do. Well…he could have side projects of course :p but…the Universe really doesn’t look like something an ethically inclined being would create. I fully admit this is not an argument cause I could find at least 5 reasons to make lots and lots of empty planets but it is an issue worth mentioning.

2. God is the Pattern of Patterns (as faeruss said)


@faeruss
– you say that what we call God is the pattern of patterns. But I want to ask you something – are these patterns similar to Plato’s Ideas or are they similar to spiritual rules, like karma ? Or are they actually the physical rules by which the Universe works ? How do you see them? Can you give an example of a sub-pattern ?

3. The Universe = God 

This was mentioned by you guys and it is one of the theories I prefer.

So, the theory is that the Universe is God and that there is some intelligence and some volition in matter, in the world itself.

Everything is in this case a huge Being containing interconnected energy points (people, animals, plants, even stones/water/fire etc) – and this Being is just growing, expanding and experiencing all there is to experience. This Being does not have to follow what every energy point is doing and punish some or reward others because they are just parts of it, like our cells. There is suffering because the Being’s growth is taking place based on some general rules and is subject to limits. Not because this Being judges and punishes us for our evil deeds.

Also, in this case the unoccupied space is just an…abiotic part of It, like a huge shell (I think shells are not abiotic, this is just a comparison to something I can think of 🙂 If God was the Universe, it could make sense for him to contain unoccupied space…because this could just be the way he developed. Oh, also this reminds me of the patterns idea, cause a snail has this part that is alive, biotic, whatever, and its shell, that is not really a living thing but still is part of the snail and it also grows according to a pattern, you know? So these two theories could be combined, I think.

4. All is One but it doesn’t look like it 

This one is different from the one in which God = the Universe. That one is pretty much Pantheism, right? And this one is closer to New Age ideas.

So…in the beginning we were one (one ball of fire having one perspective). At some point there was a Fall and somehow this ball of fire got split and all spirits got separated…and remained separated until now.The split/Fall took place for the purpose of experiencing Everything that could be.

At some point, we will all be One again and then split again and the experiences we have are somehow accessible to everyone or will be accessible when we are all One again.

This could be mixed with Theory number 3 or it could be…I think the Fall could just be the loss of the feeling of everything being interconnected. They could both be true. 2, 3 and 4 could actually all be true if the patterns were like God’s…DNA? 🙂 and God was the Universe itself and the Fall just meant a state of mind in which you believe you are separate from everything else and becoming One again was the realization that actually everything is God.

 

Oh, dear, so much woo rambling. :))

Anyway, I think my potential beliefs (cause I just see them as possibly true) are pretty much what an Se lead would be likely to think about it all (God can’t really judge you for your sins, this doesn’t make any sense :)) ; He just wants to experience everything through you :)) 😉 ).

 

 

  • This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by Bera.
  • This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by Bera.
  • This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by Bera.
  • This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by Bera.
  • This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by Bera.
  • This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by Bera.
  • This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by Bera.
  • This reply was modified 1 year, 8 months ago by Bera.

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